“Fire in the Whole”: An Interview with Robert G. Callahan, II— Part 3

“Fire in the Whole: Embracing Our Righteous Anger with White Christianity and Reclaiming Our Wholeness” is a new book by Robert G. Callahan, II. In the final part of this interview trilogy, we discuss the call to truth-telling around the wounds of white Christianity, the empowering nature of lament, rest as an act of resistance, the future of the North American church and steps you can take after reading his book.

Starlette Thomas: You wrote in the same chapter,  “We Break the Silence,” on the qualifications of African Americans to speak to their wounding by white Christianity:

“What I would love for people, especially people of color, to understand is that we who have been wounded by white Christianity are eminently qualified to recognize spiritual abuse and its conspiracy with racism when we see it—despite all we are asked or told to believe. We recognize the whip when it is brought to bear by the church because we have felt its sting in every other facet of society. We have every right to call it by name in our faith and it is holy in the eyes of God to do so. Going a step further, because our experience has imbued us with the ears to hear and eyes to see the misuse of God’s name, we have the moral obligation to do so.”

It’s a powerful affirmation and calling. Why is it paramount for African Americans to not remain silent?

Robert Callahan, II: Our experience with white supremacy is not hypothetical. We have lived experience that gives credence to our observations and concerns. 

We have to remember that white supremacy is dedicated to challenging our sanity. So, when we give voice to our observations, we not only strengthen ourselves; we legitimize what others are feeling and provide assurance to those who need it, “you’re not crazy”. 

Truth-telling enables us to break out of the silos that white Christianity strives to keep us in and reorient ourselves to a right view of reality.

ST: In “We Wear the Mask (No Longer),” you offer these powerful words:

“We’re never allowed to mourn the coordinated efforts to erase everything this nation forced our grandparents, parents, and us to endure. Every law fashioned and passed to limit the social space we can move in. Every slur and stereotype eagerly consumed and parroted by our white acquaintances. The recorded lynching of Black folks at the hands of law enforcement that is quickly relativized as we’re admonished: ‘Just move on.’” 

This is later followed by an invitation to mourn as an act of resistance. How can lament serve as a means of empowerment?

RC: Our society demands constant production from minorities. Not only are we measured by weighted scales, but we’re expected not to mention the injustice of them. 

Our suffering is demanded for the benefit of others. We’re expected to give endlessly without permission to stop to acknowledge our pains, much less the history that caused them. In fact, they want to erase history so that our rest and healing can never occur. 

We’re told things like, “Pull yourself up by your bootstraps” or “Shut up and dribble.”’ We don’t get a breather. 

So, in an environment that places so much value on exhausting and discarding us, dropping our tools to say, “We’re not doing the work anymore” is an act of resistance. Naming our pain and mourning in a healthy way, moving through the stages of grief, and prioritizing our own well-being is an act of resistance. 

ST: In “Permission to Leave,” you conclude, “The local church, where people congregate with the specific purpose of understanding what our sovereign creator has to say, should be the most reliable venue for neutralizing the effects of racism in society. Having refused to undertake that responsibility, the church can no longer rightly be seen as the church.”

Does the North American church have a future? If so, what actions should its leaders and members take to ensure its viability?

RC: Christianity will always have counterfeits. This has been true since its inception. And nothing that I’ve observed in our nation encourages me to believe that white Christianity will eventually get its stuff together. 

But the good news is that there will always be a faithful remnant. The question is whether the survivors will ever outnumber the oppressors. 

Leaders and members who would be counted among the faithful need to divest from white Christianity and build communities that are faithful witnesses to the fullness of the gospel. That requires not just leaving toxic spaces but also loudly warning of their toxicity and giving others the courage to do so. There’s not enough of that happening right now. 

In an ideal world, it would be impossible for someone who wants to be discipled by white Christianity to find a church in North America that could satisfy their desires because there would be no place for a false gospel to thrive. However, we know that will never happen. So, all that we can do is our part to denounce the heresy and lead others into healing and righteousness. 

ST: The book gathers readers around a campfire, where they are fueled to have thoughtful discussions about our spiritual wounding and finally, after “adding them to the fire,” readers leave with a lightened load and a light for their path. What steps do you hope readers take after reading your book?

RC: I truly hope readers who are struggling with the effects of white supremacy on their faith will build small communities to effectively be the church in their lives. There may not be a congregation acting as a healthy representation of the church in your community. But there are like-minded people who can strengthen you, encourage you, and build you up. 

Gather together and encourage one another. Assure one another that you’re not crazy. Love one another in all the practical ways that you need to receive God’s love. 

This doesn’t necessarily mean creating a home church. It doesn’t even necessitate you participating in a corporate church setting during this phase of life. 

It just means walking together on this journey into wholeness. The goal is not to tear down the church, but to save you from an imitation of it. 

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Robert wrote in “Closing Arguments,” “If you take nothing else away from this book, let it be the affirmation of your worth as one of God’s image- bearers, the assurance that the gospel is supremely concerned with the welfare of the marginalized, and the need to fight for your sanity in the midst of those hell- bent on depriving you of it.” It is a fitting benediction. Now, go out into the world and pick up a copy of “Fire in the Whole: Embracing Our Righteous Anger with White Christianity and Reclaiming Our Wholeness.”